Open Thread
Posted by Stuart Staniford on May 1, 2006 - 6:20pm
Scientists from the University of Cornell have discovered a massive amount of Oil off the coast of Louisiana.The find is some 60 billion barrels or 3 Times more than current US recoverable Oil of 20 Billion barrels, and would bring US total reserves to 80 billion barrels which is on par with Venezuela. In comparison to other finds around the world, this is twice the size of all Oil ever found in the North Sea and 6 times larger than the estimates of the Alaskan ANWR oil deposits.....The area is about 10,000 sq. miles in size, and was found under layers of salt dooms by a new method of oil discovery known as "gas washing" . A process in which geologist are able to track the movement of oil deposits by the way they interact with the flow of natural gas. This method helps scientists to make extremely accurate 3D-seismic maps of deep underground oil deposits and mitigate the risk involved in drilling such deep under sea wells.
....The information was gathered from source rocks deep below the sea and was discovered by a team lead by Larry Cathles, a chemical geologist from Cornell and funded by a grant from Chevron
I called and talked to Larry Cathles and he said it was a bogus fabrication. There is a large amount of source rock down there, and his group studied where it was migrating to, but in no sense did they find significant amounts of recoverable oil.
The No. 1 energy fund's wild (but energizing) ride
May 1, 2006 -- The region of the tropical Atlantic where many hurricanes originate has warmed by several tenths of a degree Celsius over the 20th century, and new climate model simulations suggest that human activity, such as increasing greenhouse gas emissions into the atmosphere, may contribute significantly to this warming. This new finding is one of several conclusions reported in a study by scientists at the NOAA Geophysical Fluid Dynamics Laboratory in Princeton, N.J., published today in the Journal of Climate.
I wonder if the record flooding occuring 'across the pond' is also attributable to global warming? I couldn't find any specific info if the snow was melting faster than normal, or if the glaciers are shrinking faster this year adding more meltwater to these flooding rivers. Maybe crucial GW data will soon be as hard to get as SA oil production from Ghawar.
http://www.allheadlinenews.com/articles/7003183392
http://www.charlotte.com/mld/observer/news/opinion/14464130.htm
Bob Shaw in Phx,Az Are Humans Smarter than Yeast?
Exxon posted profits of $36.13 billion for last year (2005). According to a dipchip, ExxonMobil produced 2.5 mbpd in 9/05. Total production is/was around 85 mbdp, so that's 3pct of total. Just say the avg price was $55/bbl.
This would mean that EM profits were a little over 2pct the of the TOTAL value of production in 2005 OR 66 pct of its own 3 pct share! Well, clearly EM derives its profits from gas and chemicals as well as oil -- so not all of this profit is attributable to oil.
On the other hand, the profits do not include the hefty compensation of the top level execs, plus the generous compensation of even the midlevel management. So the $33.16 is understated from one point of view (mine).
And EM is only one of the majors, although a biggie and probably the most profitable. It seems to me that either EM's profits are staggering for a 3 pct share of the market OR the 3pct share is misleading, i.e. they are somehow involved in profitting from a much larger share than just the 3 pct that is ascribed to them.
I still maintain, that while peak oil is here or near, we cannot exculpate the oil companies. They are a big part of the problem, though perhaps not in quite the way the public imagines. There is no good solution to the problem that is going to make the oil companies happy.
For any particular year, you will find that those hefty bonuses (which I do not condone, by the way) amount to far less than 1% of the annual profits.
I still maintain, that while peak oil is here or near, we cannot exculpate the oil companies. They are a big part of the problem, though perhaps not in quite the way the public imagines. There is no good solution to the problem that is going to make the oil companies happy.
Oil companies are doing what they are supposed to do: Find and refine oil, and make money selling it. This is what they do year in and year out, and is what they can be counted on to do in the future. I don't believe that Big Oil will make a serious move into biofuels until the time is right. And 'the time is right' when they think they can make money at it. That's not to say that they won't miscalculate and get into the game too late, but Big Oil is currently moving into projects past conventional oil (tar sands, GTL, NGL, etc.).
RR
RR
RR
RR
I think CTL is significantly decent gross EROI but net EROI (after accounting for environmental impacts) is very low, and perhaps below unity. We need more studies on these things before they scale, in any case.
RR
The hidden "economic" factor.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/4963348.stm
And I wouldnt put any country out of the reckoning to do it.
Rao
http://tinyurl.com/ee8w6
==AC
Of course, that's the philosophy of Nihilism and has been around since long before the oil age, and thus, is of no use, consequence or import on what is essentialy a technical/economic discussion....self hatred is an asthetic point of view...
"If you teach a man that he is nothing more than a gorilla with a gun, he begins to act exactly as a gorilla with a gun."
Philosopher, writer and Trappist monk, Thomas Merton
"If you teach a man that he is nothing more than a gorilla with a gun, he begins to act exactly as a gorilla with a gun."
Philosopher, writer and Trappist monk, Thomas Merton"
But if that same man was taught to be a Nobleman he will become a gorilla with a gun if you let him starve for a few weeks, and the best part is you wouldn't even have to teach his to do that.
Let's cut through the crap here. What it all boils down too is all anyone gives a shit about is your own ass and the little bipeds it produced.
"All behavior has been shaped for the maximum survival and reproductive success of the genes of the individual and/or its close kin, not of the species."
~Michael Ghiglieri
The boys at the top of the food chain are going to take a massive dump on us at the bottom real soon...
"Wherever men hold unequal power in society, they will strive to maintain it. They will use whatever means are convenient to that end and will seek to justify them by the most plausible arguments they are able to devise."
~Reinhold Neibuhr
==AC
Democratic monkeys are flinging verbal feces at Republican monkeys.
Republican monkeys are flinging verbal feces back at the Democratic monkeys.
"The Problem" will be solved by the letting of blood, by the casting of "blame". But whose blood is it that must flow? Who is to "blame"?
Who?
Who?
The monkey noises rise in a crescendo.
Individual apes plead for their lives. "I will give every man, woman and child $100 if they spare me," yelps one monkey.
"I voted for higher CAFE standards before I voted against them," yelps another monkey.
We Peak Oilers know that all these monkey noises are meaningless. Mother Nature will not exgorge a new plume of sweet crude just because the monkeys make their noises of blame. Hubbert's curve is running its course. Global Warming is running its course. And yet the monkeys shreik.
So now we TOD'ers start flinging feces at each other to decide if we are monkeys, or lemmings or some higher form of creature?
What good is it?
Let us gather together as a unified "tribe" or "herd" or "coallition" or whatever you want to call it, of rational thinking creatures and work on energy solutions rather than on the blame game (a.ka. feces flinging).
The above quote is incorrect on at least two counts.
First, there is considerable debate with regard to the level at which evolution operates: genotype, phenotype or at some other point, or at some combination of all available modalities of change. We can see this most clearly with regard to the human species where our primary advantage derives from a synthetic abstract that we call "culture." We can implement cultural change much faster than a species which relies on adaptive change via genetic mutation. Our success as a species is a clear counter-factual to the above quote.
The second inaccuracy is due to the implied teleology. The statement suggests that change is directed, or "shaped" toward some desired end point (reproductive success) and that this is an optimum outcome. The theory of punctuated equilibrium posits that change is aimless and happens more or less in random fashion during an epoch of relative stasis. After this period of stasis there is some form of major change in the environment which creates a new environment. Some portion of the existing species will be successful in this new environment and will increase their populations. Other species will find the new environment less hospitable and these will tend to die out.
From a Peak Oil perspective we can see that the overfed, overweight, overstimulated and auto-mobile members of industrial culture may have some difficulty in adapting to a post-Peak environment and may be subject to die -off. Existing pre-industrial cultures will not suffer the same negative impacts, in fact their territory is likely to increase due to the die-off of the oil dependent. The key understanding here is that nature not only rolls the dice, she is constantly changing the rules of the game. Some species do better under one set of circumstances than others. But no one can predict with certainty what future conditions will be. Therefore no one can accurately predict the required adaptations in advance. I fearlessly place my bets on Bob's yeast.
"It rapidly became clear to me that the most imaginative way of looking at evolution, and the most inspiring way of teaching it, was to say that it's all about the genes. It's the genes that, for their own good, are manipulating the bodies they ride about in. The individual organism is a survival machine for its genes."
~Richard Dawkins
That is Dawkins point of view and it is a very imaginative point of view and it helps open up the thought realm to the range of possibilities with regard to what we call evolutionary change. I tend to favour the perspective of Eldredge and Gould (1972).
Is Dawkins view the current accepted conventional scientific wisdom? I do not believe so. I have not kept current on all the levels of the debate because it is taking place at a multitude of levels within different disciplines.
The following is fairly good introduction to the issues:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Punctuated_equilibrium
I personally have extremely little tolerance for nihilism, the Apocalypticons, etc. If I really believed what these extreme pessimists claim they believe, I would have offed myself some time back.
Human beings have indeed managed to screw up a hell of a lot, but we've also done a lot of things right. I prefer to remain optimistic and focused on the task of educating people about the energy challenges we're just beginning to encounter (which I still contend is the best way to prepare for what's coming). If I turn out to be wrong, them's the breaks. But at least I'll have a lot more fun along the way than the people dusting off their Y2K bunker plans.
"Gradually, by selective breeding, the congenital differences between rulers and ruled will increase until they become almost different species. A revolt of the plebs would become as unthinkable as an organized insurrection of sheep against the practice of eating mutton."
~Bertrand Russell, The Impact of Science on Society
http://tinyurl.com/ms3nu
==AC
Welcome my son
Welcome to the machine
What did you dream?
It's alright we told you what to dream
You dreamed of a big star
He played a mean gituar
He always ate in the Steak Bar
He loved to drive in his Jaguar
So welcome to the Machine
Benedictines are pretty much the definition of intentional community, and when they work as designed, provide a compelling counterweight to the Angry Chimp view that in the end we're just in it for ourselves.
FWIIW, Merton might have objected to being called a philosopher. He was an existentialist, coming to a slightly different opinion of ultimate realities than the atheistic existentialists.
IMO, there's a place in the world for nihilism, just as there is for other philosophical arguments. You can make a case for them all, which just proves that humans and their behavior are complex and multifaceted. We can be gloriously noble and horribly depraved (and everything in between). Our survival as a species will depend on which aspect is paramount at crucial points in time.
http://www.motherjones.com/commentary/columns/2006/05/predator_state.html
Computing the commute
http://www.truthout.org/docs_2006/050106S.shtml
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/05/01/world/americas/01cnd-bolivia.html
To pick up a point raised at various times by westexas and Dave: any country's nationalization of oil or gas seems to imply that there will be more local resource use, and less export. That's not inevitable, but it seems to follow.
http://www.raisethehammer.org/blog.asp?id=220
Bio-Butanol
RR
I know a company that is quietly converting engines to acetylene. Seems to work well and is very efficient.
Have you ever looked into this fuel for transportation? They have several cars already converted. Their main effort at the moment is community-scale power plants.
RR
Here's the company's information site:
http://www.afuelsllc.com/story.htm
So, if someone had a source of calcium carbide, you could easily create acetylene. But if you had to first create the calcium carbide, I wouldn't think the energy balance would be very good.
RR
I really hope you beat this ghastly disease, and live way, way, past Peak Oil, which I guess all of us will. Good Luck and keep on truckin'.
The doctor doesn't seem to be too concerned. Very early detection. He said I could probably ignore it for 10 years, but that would be taking some chances.
I've thought about the possibility that if enough things were to go wrong with the economy, getting something as simple as prostate surgergy might become very difficult in the future. So I think I'll do it now rather than later.
Is there such a thing as Peak medical care?
I'm puzzled by the lead story (60 Gb). How did this rumour get started? And it's being repeated elsewhere, though not much. Since the reserves figure couldn't have come from Cathles, who fabricated it?
Talk about grasping at straws.
Thanks for the horses-mouth debunkage. Earlier today I searched Cornell, Chevron, CNN, Fox, ABC, etc. and found no reference to this "discovery," so I assumed it was false. Can't always believe what you read.
If there were a major discovery in the Gulf, the MSM would pick up on it very quickly, especially in this high energy cost environment.
I didn't make the connection when Yankee introduced herself. I just smiled and shook her hand thinking, "oh my God there are crazed obsessed New York Yankee baseball fans showing up here." Then she mentioned TOD and I understood.
Best,
Matt
The slightly less obsessed are glued to the TV/computer...
What is your assessment of the conference--people merely alarmed, scared to death, or believing in technical solutions to save the day? Were there any Congressional figures there besides Roscoe Bartlett? Any new billionaires join the fold, or is Richard Rainwater and T. Boone Pickens the only ones willing to come out of the Peakoil closet? Are they concerned about Westexas & Khebab's theory of rapid export depletion? Please give us your two cents or put it on your LATOC website ASAP. Thxs
Bob Shaw in Phx,Az Are Humans Smarter than Yeast?
Are there any conferences occuring in the Southwest this year? Specifically, in the Pasadena/Los Angeles areas. Deffeyes spoke at Caltech recently, but an "Energy Solutions" conference here would be immensely useful, at least in terms of getting in touch with likeminded people.
The engineering aspect of this site always strikes me a relentlessly male - not in a negative way, after all I still possess a Y chromosone the last time I checked, but I am always happy to learn of gender diversification. And it the women of the world who make the important decisions.
Is any skyscraper or other multi-story building in America doing anything like this, or are we too fat and lazy?
Japanese Workers Urged To Ditch Elevators, Take The Stairs
http://www.allheadlinenews.com/articles/7003387496
Bob Shaw in Phx,AZ Are Humans Smarter than Yeast?
RR
"Yeah, but too many heart attacks occur from taking the elevators all your life".
RR
Taking the stairs is Anti-American, like walking.
Referencing it as University of Cornell is laughable - unless there is such a place in another country (?)
Crucial to understanding detritus entropy and Malthusian effects is how it affects others around the world who cannot afford the detritus essentials we here in America take for granted. Consider this Yahoo article and how easily you and your children will can adapt to this lifestyle in ten, fifteen, twenty years:
http://hotzone.yahoo.com/b/hotzone/20060501/hz_haiti_0506/blogs4010
Bob Shaw in Phx,AZ Are Humans Smarter than Yeast?
I just don't understand why people, who know they have very little money, resources, etc., have so many children. At this point in time when the human species needs to reduce its population, many are popping out kids as fast as they can, and in the poorest of conditions. Do these children grow up or do a lot of them die before adulthood / puberty? If the latter, are we looking at what could become of 1st world nations in JHK's worst-case scenario? A lot of authors talk about population reduction, but what will it actually look like?
Rising living standards tend to lead to smaller families - after a lag.
This is why giving $3 medicated mosquito nettings to the poorest in Kenya is a sound investment.
In that case, I expect the younger American adults to start 'shagging' like crazy after they read this alarming bit of Yahoo news:
--------------
The trustees, who include the head of the Social Security Administration and three members of the Cabinet, said long-term growth rates for both programs were not "sustainable under current financing arrangements."
Treasury Secretary John Snow, chairman of the trustees group, said without action "the coming demographic bulge will drive federal spending to unprecedented levels."
----------------
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060502/ap_on_go_ot/social_security
Bob Shaw in Phx,AZ Are Humans Smarter than Yeast?
Even worse, we will wind up having to hike income taxes all the way back to the sixties level when the baby boomers are older and need nursing home care to pay back the social security "trust fund".
No wonder they are panicking.
Its much worse than the message they are trying to communicate. They say that the Socal Security system goes bust in 2040. In reality, it goes bust in 2012 when the outlays exceed the revenue. The 2040 estimate assumes that the gov't can actually use the 2+ Trillion in Gov't IOUs to finance SS past 2012.
For those unaware, there is no trust fund for Social Security collections. The excess capital that is collected is used to finance the General Gov't budget. Since all of this capital is already spent there is no surplus to draw on. By 2012 when the outlays (money paid to retirees) exceeds Social Security collections, the gov't will be forced to substantially increases taxes or dramatically cut federal spending. Either way it spells a fiscal disaster. Certainly by 2012 the world will have slid past Peak Oil, compounding the problem. Starting 2008 when the first large groups of boomers are eligable for retirement, the SS surplus will start to decline. This will begin to apply fiscal pressure on states and the federal job as expenses begin to rise at the same time revenues per capita decline.
The perfect financial Storm: Medicare, Social Security, Peak Oil, Currency devaluation, massive trade and federal debts, and Excessive debt laden consumers.
"It rapidly became clear to me that the most imaginative way of looking at evolution, and the most inspiring way of teaching it, was to say that it's all about the genes. It's the genes that, for their own good, are manipulating the bodies they ride about in. The individual organism is a survival machine for its genes."
~Richard Dawkins
==AC
Lou - just an observation, not a judgement. My GSA operates the same way, as does everybody's. The difference is in our respective environments.
Best,
MAtt
Sadly, this is the normal human sexual response since time eternal. The same thing is occurring in Banda Aceh and other areas from last year's Indian Ocean tsunami. Recall that many, many children died. Even though the surviving adults have lost everything, they are desperately trying to conceive as fast as they can.
Bob Shaw in Phx,AZ Are Humans Smarter than Yeast?
You can have the modern version from Hiram Johnson or the classic from Aeschylus, doesn't matter in the end. To expect truth in time of conflict is beyond naive.
Maybe $3.25/gal is not eating your wallet inside out buddy. The rest of us are starting to feel the pain.
(When and oil closes at or above $76 ($38 times two), for the near term price--I think prices farther out have already been there, I recommend that we proclaim it Daniel Yergin Day, in honor of his prediction that oil prices would be at $38 barrel on 11/1/05, and in honor of his numerous predictions that we were facing a glut of crude oil. IMO, these guys that have, in effect, been encouraging Americans to continue buying large SUV's to drive to and from large mortgages, deserve every bit of scorn and ridicule that we can dump on them--just my opinion, anyway.)
The following column was published on 11/1/04:
Digital Rules
Capitalism's Amazing Resilience
Rich Karlgaard, 11.01.04, 12:00 AM ET
Excerpt:
Energy is one of the two leading risks in the global economy. (Terrorism, of course, is the other.) Just take a look at one industry already suffering from oil shock--U.S.-based airlines will lose $5 billion this year. That loss matches the bump in fuel prices. Ouch. Then there's China, which has climbed to the world's number two spot in oil consumption. China uses most of its oil wildly inefficiently to generate electricity. Oil consumption by cars barely registers--now. But during the next four years, China's oil imports will double as the Chinese give up their bicycles. Biting your nails yet? Here's one more sobering oil fact: The world has only a 1% short-term cushion. This makes for a very volatile market.
Given these facts, where will oil prices be a year from now--$75 a barrel? $100?
Wrong numbers, says Daniel Yergin. Wrong direction, too. Try $38. Yergin knows oil. He is a founder and the chairman of Cambridge Energy Research Associates, a consultancy that has 230 employees, with offices worldwide. He is also a recipient of the United States Energy Award and a member of the Secretary of Energy's Advisory Board. A former Harvard professor, Yergin is best known for his Pulitzer Prize-winning book on oil, The Prize: The Epic Quest for Oil, Money and Power.
Yergin's prediction of cheaper oil prices is noteworthy because he doesn't dispute any of the alarming facts cited in my opening paragraph. Not that he would. The facts came straight from Yergin's own mouth at the recent Forbes Global CEO Conference in Hong Kong. I jotted down Yergin's comments while listening to him speak at a dinner. Then he gave a formal speech the next morning and, fueled this time by highly caffeinated tea, I again took notes, just to be sure. Yergin is pretty clear about his predictions. He says oil demand will rise, yet prices will drop. How can this be?
Answer: capitalism's amazing resiliency. Oil prices rise--oilmen become innovative. They work, they invest, they put their heads to the task, they apply technology, and pretty soon they'll discover how to extract oil profitably from oil sand. Or open wells in deeper water. Or scour the planet for new sources using scanners thousands of miles in space. As Yergin reminds us, oil output is 60% higher today than it was in the 1970s. Not many sages from the 1970s would have bet their reputations on this development. The opposite sentiment prevailed back then; experts said the planet was running out of oil. Wrong.
Yergin says he's always asked when oil will run out for good. He shrugs. He's willing to say the world will need 40% more oil in 2025. Hard work and technology probably will find a way to meet the demand. The funniest thing--and I saw this happen--is that many people who ask Yergin this question are disappointed with his answer. It's as if they want oil to run out.
http://www.cera.com/news/details/1,,7777,00.html
Excerpt:
Are we running out of oil? CERA's belief is that the world is not running out of oil imminently or in the near to medium term. Indeed, CERA projects that world oil production capacity has the potential to rise from 87 million barrels per day (mbd) in 2005 to as much as 108 mbd by 2015. After 2015 we see further growth in capacity. Our outlook contradicts those who believe that peak oil is imminent.
Yergin Day at $76/barrel--terrific idea! Hopefully the MSM will ask him for comments on how he was so wrong for so long.
I have no idea when the very last pint of crude oil will be extracted, but if we continue our present course it will be pretty obvious what that last pint is exchanged for: a traveling flintrock trader will use it to grease the wooden axle on his overloaded oxen-cart!
Bob Shaw in Phx,Az Are Humans Smarter than Yeast?
Cant find the page number now since the book has been lent to a friend.
Rao
I think they call your technique good old journalism.
As Gasoline Prices Soar, Americans Resist Major Cuts in Consumption
Some excerpts (quoted paragraphs are not all contiguous in the original article):
Unfortanately, a paid subscription is required, but the article will probably be at http://www.post-gazette.com/businessnews tomorrow or Wednesday.
High Gas Prices Will Last Years, Bush Aides Say
http://www.latimes.com/news/printedition/la-na-gas1may01,1,3546019.story
"WASHINGTON -- Gasoline prices will remain high for years to come and will be largely unaffected by a new White House plan to bring them down, Bush administration officials said Sunday.
"Energy Secretary Samuel W. Bodman said the United States faced an oil price 'crisis' because surging demand from such countries as China and India had outstripped supply, and he predicted that it would be 'two to three years before suppliers are in a position to meet the demands.'"
I've noticed this story line appearing more often lately. Gas prices are high and are going to stay there, but only for a couple of years. New supplies are in the pipeline but it will take a while for them to get into production and make a difference. Starting around 2008 we will see major increases in production and get back into an "oil glut", with markedly lower prices.
I don't know how much these projections are wishful thinking versus being based on credible scenarios, but I guess we'll find out in about three years.
RR
I would not be surprised if, two to three years from now, we will be told that it will be "two to three years before suppliers are in a position to meet the demands."
That said, one can interpret Bodman's comments as an astute way of suggesting that we start to "make other arrangements," as Kunstler is so fond of saying.
Seriously, there are only two viable scenarios that will make gasoline cheaper than today.
A while back, in another thread, someone mentioned the investment potential of toilet paper. It didn't really click until I read the above from the May 2nd NYT.
I have been posting about Zimbabwe for several years in the Yahoo:AlasBabylon forum. This is stagflation optimized--totally worthless currency and 80% unemployment rate with millions starving. Yet Pres. Mugabe is still paying off his country's IMF debts.
I think the same scenario will occur in the US--'helicopter Ben' Bernanke [Fed Chairman] showering us with million dollar bills for us to use as toilet paper while the real assets go overseas to the creditors. Our children will have every reason to be disappointed with how we have mismanaged their financial future.
Bob Shaw in Phx,Az Are Humans Smarter than Yeast?
Inflation is an insidious way for the banking cartel to do exactly what they are in business to do, take your energy and money away from you and make money doing essentially nothing.
I dont mind if you put it in your blog, just credit pedex if asked.
peace
Would that also be the source of the 80 billion barrels that I posted on before? I am quite interested what people think of this claim, made by what appears to be a US governmental service, judging from the domainname.
http://www.mms.gov/revaldiv/RedNatAssessment.htm
"The MMS estimates that the quantity of undiscovered technically recoverable resources ranges from 66.6 to 115.3 billion barrels of oil and 326.4 to 565.9 trillion cubic feet of natural gas. The mean or average estimate is 85.9 billion barrels of oil and 419.9 trillion cubic feet of natural gas. These volumes of UTRR for the OCS represent about 60 percent of the total oil and 40 percent of the total natural gas estimated to be contained in undiscovered fields in the United States. The mean estimates for both oil and gas increased about 15 percent compared to the 2001 assessment. For the oil resources, the vast majority of this increase occurred in the deepwater areas of the Gulf of Mexico, while for gas resources the majority of the increase was in deep gas plays located beneath the shallow water shelf of the Gulf of Mexico."
Excellent find! If true, could keep the US as a dominant economic and military power for years, but could also really juice the global warming effects unless this carbon was sequestered. Burned incorrectly: the massive and numerous hurricanes will probably make GoM production extremely seasonal.
I will leave it to the TOD experts as to whether this report is a MilGov scam or actually true.
Bob Shaw in Phx,AZ Are Humans Smarter than Yeast?